Rachel: It's a personal demon?
Tara: Mmmm, basically, I cheated on my boyfriend of 9 months. With this guy and... why does that happen? What's going on inside myself to make me cheat on every single boyfriend I've ever had?
And I think it's because I like to hurt people that I love. I like to have control over people's emotions. And it just doesn't make any sense. And now I'm hanging out with that guy again.
Rachel: The one that you cheated on him with?
Tara: With, yeah.
But I really like him, he was one of the guys who was at the Riverside Market last night. And we just have this crazy connection. I don't get it. But he's really cool and what happened was, my boyfriend was in Madras, and he got a job at the prison out there and he's all getting responsible and doing stuff with his life.
Rachel: Being a grown up?
Tara: Yeah, he's being a grown up. And I'm not. I'm just having fun and living my young adolescent life.
Rachel: That's a weird place to live though. I mean, it's so out of the way
Tara: I know! He's like, you should live out here! And I'm like, NnnnnnnO.
*laugh*
Rachel: Absolutely not.
So your facing that demon? You're possessed by a demon that continues these trends?
I guess what a demon is, a lot of people have said, it's unhealthy patterns. Or destructive things. A demon maybe gives you power, maybe gives you some kind of authority. It seems that there's a lot of good that comes out a demon. If you work with one, or barter with one.
Ultimately the product is spiritual annihilation. That's the ultimate product of dealing with demons.
I guess what a demon is, a lot of people have said, it's unhealthy patterns. Or destructive things. A demon maybe gives you power, maybe gives you some kind of authority. It seems that there's a lot of good that comes out a demon. If you work with one, or barter with one.
Ultimately the product is spiritual annihilation. That's the ultimate product of dealing with demons.
Like what you do, kind of fits in with that. It's spiritual annihilation. Does it eventually serve you for the greater good? Is it the act of just being yourself maybe?
Tara: I feel like out of every bad terrible situation something good has to happen. Something good can be produced from it. I'm such a positive person. And eventhough I know that my ex-boyfriend is totally hurt, he's moving on. He's doing fine. We thought we were going to get married. And I guess I just realized one drunken evening that I didn't want that. And I proceeded with this other guy.
Rachel: Are you polyamorous? Do you think?
Tara: What does that mean?
Rachel: Where you feel comfortable having a lot of partners. All being in the context of a relationship. It's not promiscious. Polyamorous is where you are in love with multiple people.
Tara: Um. I could say that. Not at a time. Really. I like attention from multiple people but I'll only have sex with one person at a time.
One of the things I have a hard time doing is making up my mind for myself and following my inner voice. I just don't even have it, or I don't even hear it. I don't have an inner voice of reason. So I just do whatever the hell I want to at the moment. And then I tell my friends about it and they're like, "Wull, what the hell are you doing, that's not right." and I'm like, "Sooo... I'm having fun."
Rachel: You don't have a conscience?
Tara: Something like that! And my best friend is ...
We're interrupted by someone coming by
Rachel: (coming back after interruption) If you feel like you're hurting yourself or you're destroying your spirit. A conscience is only what you make. People create their own reality there is not god that says simply we should be doing this and that. If we're doing unhealthy things to ourselves or putting ourselves out of balance...
Tara: It's all perspective.
Rachel: If you're happy with your life and you can look at yourself in the mirror...
Tara: That's kind of what my mom said to me, "As long as you're having fun." And then I thought about and well shit! I could have fun killing babies and robbing banks.
Rachel: FUCK! Ok, whoa. Ok, now... maybe if you really do not have a conscience that's concerning.
Tara: No, I'm joking. It was an exaggeration.
Rachel: I'm hoping you would hesitate.
Tara: My voice of reason comes from my best friend who's in California and she was just up here last week for a week and she pretty much forced me to kick this guy out of my life who I cheated on my boyfriend with. But, we've been hanging out for three and half weeks after Greg and I broke up and we went to Crater Lake, we went on bike rides, we did this amazing stuff. We went camping and, I thought, I've done more stuff with you in three weeks than I've done with Greg in 9 months.
Rachel: That's saying a lot.
Tara: So, I just feel like Greg and I were really good together but we were a little too different. You know, how opposites attract. We were just a little bit too different. She's telling me that I need to stop seeing this guy so I did. And then he's like, "Well, what the hell?!" all of a sudden.
Rachel: Why does she not want you to see him?
Tara: Because I posted pictures of facebook of him and I together and my Mom reposted the picture and my Mom and Greg were friends so Greg saw the pictures of this guy and me at Crater Lake. Then Leslie called me as I was at dinner with this new guy and she says, "What the hell are you doing? I've just sat back and let you do your thing and now I am going to fucking unleash."
Rachel: Are you still with your guy in Madras?
Tara: Nuh-nuh. No. He broke up with me. It happened on a Thursday. I drove out to Madras on Friday, told him what happened. And then he drove to Bend on Saturday at 7:30 in the morning and broke up with me at Richard's Donuts. It was really shitty.
Rachel: You probably saw it coming though...
Tara: Yeah, I know, but I also kind of just ignored it. And had my head in the clouds for a long time. And didn't deal with it. I was just being selfish and ignoring his feelings.
Rachel: Are you hurt? Are you ok?
Tara: I think so. I mean, how long am I going to have to wait until I move on? I feel like I might ... I'm hurt that I hurt someone. And that it didn't work out. And that it had to end up that way. But overall I'm pretty ok with it.
Rachel: You think the demons are you not taking people's feelings into context?
Tara: Exactly. Because I've done it everyone I love. My friends. They say, "how did you do that to me?" I'm just not thinking. I guess I'm not very mindful of the outcomes of situations.
Rachel: That's interesting. My friend Stephanie, her boyfriend cheated on her and they've been going through this major thing. Break up and get back together. It's insane. It's a lot of anger. But I got involved with her when they were on the outs and I had to apologize to him because he was upset with me (when they were back together). And it was a very weird circle of hurting and trying to see.. we could all see each others positions, because we were going through it ourselves. Not exactly in the same... I was hurt by my ex-boyfriend sleeping with other people... and then I just realized this is being recorded and do I really want to tell this story on the record? I don't. I don't...
And so, I knew how he felt, but when I was looking at him I was thinking, "I can't connect with you, I can't connect with your feelings at all." I know how I felt in an identical situation but I can't connect to that sadness. I'm think, "get over it, what is the big deal?"
Tara: Right, his reaction to it.
Rachel: He would say the same thing. I try to be sympathetic but looking at anyone's situation.. you just heard the story second or third source. You might think, "why don't they just get along?" They look cute together, why don't they just make it work?" Connecting to those emotions it takes a lot of energy. And it's pretty made-up, it's pretty fictitious even when you do. I don't think any of us have that ability to really connect to people. To be truly empathetic, it's a godlike thing. Do a bunch of yoga and eat raw veggies and then you can truly connect to the universal pain of betrayal. I think we're pretty immune to each other, most of time.
Tara: Some people are very... this is going to sound cheesy but, certain zodiac are more cautious and in-tune with people's feelings. And not even feelings but personality traits too. Some people can just look at someone and be like, "Oh, I know exactly what your trying to do here and I can read you."
Rachel: That's so true. That is really true. I do not have that ability. But you see people cry over other people's things. I only cry if it's at a movie and they build me up and play it up a certain way. I get that sadness! But wouldn't just get it automatically. Who do you know that's like that?
Tara: My mom. Through this whole break up situation she has been more emotional than I have. Because she takes on the pain of everyone around her. She's a martyr. She wants to fix everyone's problems. To a fault. I had say, "Mom! Just stop reading into this! Just leave it alone, you're freaking me out."
Rachel: How does it affect the way she lives her life then? To be in that position? Is she really nice and really careful?
Tara: Well, for example she adopted two of my cousins who's parents, her siblings, couldn't take care of them. So she she adopted them.
Rachel: Damn, yeah, there are seriously, now that I think of it, there are people that do that kind of thing. Just do shit like that all the time. That's awesome. I'm so glad there are people like that in the world.
Tara: Yep, it's true. And there's people like me who are like doot doot doot, head in the clouds.
Rachel: Right?!
Tara: It's like, "life is fun! Why are you crying?"
Rachel: Maybe some people are demons and some people are angels. Some people like me and you that can't really feel people's pain and we're a little bit detached from it. When it comes to me to confess something that I've done - it's really weird because I can't really imagine how they're feeling. I just imagine them being pissed off at me and that sucking. And then some people just get it. So funny.. I get it with animals. Whenever someone abuses animals *angry sound* I feel for animals all the time.
Tara: Ah, that's sweet.
I hope this is helpful..
Rachel: It is.
Tara: In some way.
Rachel: What did you have in your journal? Just kind of processing what your going through?
Tara: Um, yeah, when I think of demons I think of bring torn between two different things. Like, a devil on shoulder and an angel on the other shoulder.
Rachel: Oooo, totally! I haven't used that visual.
Tara: So, this was on Friday.
"I'll say it again, I feel so at peace and relaxed at this moment. My creativity is flowing freely and I feel I have a firm grasp on myself and the world around me. I feel very in tune with my feelings, thoughts and ideas, emotions, etc. But by the same token I feel weak and vulnerable. Almost like a scab forming on a wound. Also, I have some funky summer sickness... blahblahblah..."
I wrote this one Friday and I felt so strong in my decision to not talk to Jacob (new guy) anymore and to not drink, not smoke, just BE A GOOD PERSON. And try to get Greg back was what I wanted to do on Friday. And now, I am hanging out with him again. It's crazy how one minute I'm here the next minute I'm there. And I wonder if it's like demon and angels or ...
Rachel: You think the angel on one side is telling you to not smoke and drink and this and that and the demon on the other side is telling you to do whatever the fuck you want?
Tara: Yeah. It's all about pleasure. Because doing the fun thing isn't always the right thing.
Rachel: That's a hard call though because, people, I'm thinking about homosexuals, will repress crap like that all the time because there's an angel on their shoulder that tells them to celibate and deny who they are and the demon says, "you should have a bunch of anal sex with a bunch of guys." Having a bunch of anal sex with a bunch of guys you should be doing because you're a gay man and have crazy testosterone levels and that's who you are and you should do it!
Tara: It doesn't mean it's bad, doing what, go back and forth,
There are some lives that we appreciate, for example, my mom, or my best friend or my roommates who are judging me behind my back. What's right? What's wrong? And I'm kind of to the point where I haven't told Leslie that I've been hanging out with him because I thought, "I'm going to prove everyone wrong because everyone thinks I'm going to go straight back to him once you leave." Because I was gung-ho about not seeing Jacob, because he destroyed my relationship and all this. Then I saw him Friday at the Harley Bourbon show and it was like, BOOM. We just had this crazy connection so why fight it?
Rachel: Yeah, why not? My friend, you know Natty, maybe? Natty was telling me that different people that come into your life, as in relationships, are like pop-quizzes and you have to ask yourself, "is this the right person? And you find that they're not and you have to let it go. You realize, this is not a soulmate. It's just a pop-quiz. And why hold onto something when .. and I have another belief in the Flow and you just have to follow the Flow, you need to follow your heart and maybe being with anyone, being in a monogamous relationship, getting married does ultimately seem like a very traditional way of pursuing happiness but maybe you need to be an 80-year-old woman who chronically cheats on 80-year-old men. Who knows?
Tara: That's hilarious. And I know I'm not some totally crazy person because I've talked to lots of people. And they say, "I've done the same thing. I'm cheating on my boyfriend right now."
Rachel: Fuck! Really?
Hey, speaking of the devil! (Natty comes up) (interruption)
Tara: Exactly. Because I've done it everyone I love. My friends. They say, "how did you do that to me?" I'm just not thinking. I guess I'm not very mindful of the outcomes of situations.
Rachel: That's interesting. My friend Stephanie, her boyfriend cheated on her and they've been going through this major thing. Break up and get back together. It's insane. It's a lot of anger. But I got involved with her when they were on the outs and I had to apologize to him because he was upset with me (when they were back together). And it was a very weird circle of hurting and trying to see.. we could all see each others positions, because we were going through it ourselves. Not exactly in the same... I was hurt by my ex-boyfriend sleeping with other people... and then I just realized this is being recorded and do I really want to tell this story on the record? I don't. I don't...
And so, I knew how he felt, but when I was looking at him I was thinking, "I can't connect with you, I can't connect with your feelings at all." I know how I felt in an identical situation but I can't connect to that sadness. I'm think, "get over it, what is the big deal?"
Tara: Right, his reaction to it.
Rachel: He would say the same thing. I try to be sympathetic but looking at anyone's situation.. you just heard the story second or third source. You might think, "why don't they just get along?" They look cute together, why don't they just make it work?" Connecting to those emotions it takes a lot of energy. And it's pretty made-up, it's pretty fictitious even when you do. I don't think any of us have that ability to really connect to people. To be truly empathetic, it's a godlike thing. Do a bunch of yoga and eat raw veggies and then you can truly connect to the universal pain of betrayal. I think we're pretty immune to each other, most of time.
Tara: Some people are very... this is going to sound cheesy but, certain zodiac are more cautious and in-tune with people's feelings. And not even feelings but personality traits too. Some people can just look at someone and be like, "Oh, I know exactly what your trying to do here and I can read you."
Rachel: That's so true. That is really true. I do not have that ability. But you see people cry over other people's things. I only cry if it's at a movie and they build me up and play it up a certain way. I get that sadness! But wouldn't just get it automatically. Who do you know that's like that?
Tara: My mom. Through this whole break up situation she has been more emotional than I have. Because she takes on the pain of everyone around her. She's a martyr. She wants to fix everyone's problems. To a fault. I had say, "Mom! Just stop reading into this! Just leave it alone, you're freaking me out."
Rachel: How does it affect the way she lives her life then? To be in that position? Is she really nice and really careful?
Tara: Well, for example she adopted two of my cousins who's parents, her siblings, couldn't take care of them. So she she adopted them.
Rachel: Damn, yeah, there are seriously, now that I think of it, there are people that do that kind of thing. Just do shit like that all the time. That's awesome. I'm so glad there are people like that in the world.
Tara: Yep, it's true. And there's people like me who are like doot doot doot, head in the clouds.
Rachel: Right?!
Tara: It's like, "life is fun! Why are you crying?"
Rachel: Maybe some people are demons and some people are angels. Some people like me and you that can't really feel people's pain and we're a little bit detached from it. When it comes to me to confess something that I've done - it's really weird because I can't really imagine how they're feeling. I just imagine them being pissed off at me and that sucking. And then some people just get it. So funny.. I get it with animals. Whenever someone abuses animals *angry sound* I feel for animals all the time.
Tara: Ah, that's sweet.
I hope this is helpful..
Rachel: It is.
Tara: In some way.
Rachel: What did you have in your journal? Just kind of processing what your going through?
Tara: Um, yeah, when I think of demons I think of bring torn between two different things. Like, a devil on shoulder and an angel on the other shoulder.
Rachel: Oooo, totally! I haven't used that visual.
Tara: So, this was on Friday.
"I'll say it again, I feel so at peace and relaxed at this moment. My creativity is flowing freely and I feel I have a firm grasp on myself and the world around me. I feel very in tune with my feelings, thoughts and ideas, emotions, etc. But by the same token I feel weak and vulnerable. Almost like a scab forming on a wound. Also, I have some funky summer sickness... blahblahblah..."
I wrote this one Friday and I felt so strong in my decision to not talk to Jacob (new guy) anymore and to not drink, not smoke, just BE A GOOD PERSON. And try to get Greg back was what I wanted to do on Friday. And now, I am hanging out with him again. It's crazy how one minute I'm here the next minute I'm there. And I wonder if it's like demon and angels or ...
Rachel: You think the angel on one side is telling you to not smoke and drink and this and that and the demon on the other side is telling you to do whatever the fuck you want?
Tara: Yeah. It's all about pleasure. Because doing the fun thing isn't always the right thing.
Rachel: That's a hard call though because, people, I'm thinking about homosexuals, will repress crap like that all the time because there's an angel on their shoulder that tells them to celibate and deny who they are and the demon says, "you should have a bunch of anal sex with a bunch of guys." Having a bunch of anal sex with a bunch of guys you should be doing because you're a gay man and have crazy testosterone levels and that's who you are and you should do it!
Tara: It doesn't mean it's bad, doing what, go back and forth,
There are some lives that we appreciate, for example, my mom, or my best friend or my roommates who are judging me behind my back. What's right? What's wrong? And I'm kind of to the point where I haven't told Leslie that I've been hanging out with him because I thought, "I'm going to prove everyone wrong because everyone thinks I'm going to go straight back to him once you leave." Because I was gung-ho about not seeing Jacob, because he destroyed my relationship and all this. Then I saw him Friday at the Harley Bourbon show and it was like, BOOM. We just had this crazy connection so why fight it?
Rachel: Yeah, why not? My friend, you know Natty, maybe? Natty was telling me that different people that come into your life, as in relationships, are like pop-quizzes and you have to ask yourself, "is this the right person? And you find that they're not and you have to let it go. You realize, this is not a soulmate. It's just a pop-quiz. And why hold onto something when .. and I have another belief in the Flow and you just have to follow the Flow, you need to follow your heart and maybe being with anyone, being in a monogamous relationship, getting married does ultimately seem like a very traditional way of pursuing happiness but maybe you need to be an 80-year-old woman who chronically cheats on 80-year-old men. Who knows?
Tara: That's hilarious. And I know I'm not some totally crazy person because I've talked to lots of people. And they say, "I've done the same thing. I'm cheating on my boyfriend right now."
Rachel: Fuck! Really?
Hey, speaking of the devil! (Natty comes up) (interruption)
*Names changed
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